straight walled cartridges for deer hunting

Pennsylvania has joined other states in giving'straight walled" firearms special consideation for deer hunting. In past years certain urban areas were restricted to "shotgun only". Now straight walled pistol like cartridge firearms will be allowed in most of those areas.

This means pistols and rifles meeting the definition will be allowed.

https://www.post-gazette.com/life/ou...nes-Newsletter

Sofa

“ The IQ and the life expectancy of the average American recently passed each other in opposite directions.”

Yep, seems the new law says some slight taper is allowed. So 45-70 is ok. NO case length or bullet style or size required.

I have a 44 mag lever Marrlin (NIB, for 30 years).

“ The IQ and the life expectancy of the average American recently passed each other in opposite directions.”

I've killed some deer with the 44 mag in lever rifles. most were at 90 yds of less. Not all exited.

I've got a 44 handgun with a scope, never shot anything with it, but paper....very accurate.

in reality, deer are very easy to kill with proper shot placement. somehow, if we think they are rugger to kill it makes the challenge and hunt greater?

“ The IQ and the life expectancy of the average American recently passed each other in opposite directions.”

If we were restricted to these kinds of things I'd go with a lever action in 45-70. Like D said, It would be effective out to ranges that you wouldn't see in a heavily wooded area.

Just my thoughts.

Wing master

I have always considered myself to be quite the bullshitter, But ocasionally it is nice to sit back and listen to a true professional......So, Carry on.

Been looking for a reason to get that 22 short. Straight walled deer slayer up to bear! Without the worry of over penetration! Wink

Turnbull makes some fine custom 86's in 45-70, 45-90, 50-70, 50-90 and all the way up to the 50-120. Bigboreleverguns has some loads close to 3k fps with 500gr. hardcast in his 50. Straightwalled and ready to tenderize on either end. More then enough for any of the big five......x2!

12 gauge 1 1/4 oz at 1450 fps vs 220 gr .44 at very similar speed.....gotta favor that 12. Throw in a hot loaded 45-70 and then you get range. Sadly many of the 45-70 loads on the market give you around the same 1400 fps of the other pistol calibers.....which is pretty much what the cartridge was designed at. Killed many a bison with those old low and slow speed boolits way back when.

BTW, you can shoot 45 and 50 caliber sabots out of a 12 at speeds rivaling the centerfires. Jerry hits the 1000k gong with his....but then again, he does it with his 44mag as well. Guy is at a whole 'nother level

...oh yeah! thats gonna hurt!

No limit on case length nor minimum caliber or energy. So 45-70 is in and so is 32ACP in a rifle or revolver (no autoloaders).

“ The IQ and the life expectancy of the average American recently passed each other in opposite directions.”

460 S&W is short enough for those rules and will reach out for a deer sized game well past 200 yards. but it does have a tapered case which is allowed for pistol cartridge centerfire. the 500 mag. and 350 Legend seem to be the goto's for the straightwall folks restricted in length. Folks in Ohio can still use the 45-70 but it is the max length cartridge.

...oh yeah! thats gonna hurt!

If you are going to use a rifle that you already have I'd go with your .44 Mag.

By the way, What rifle is it?

Wing master

I have always considered myself to be quite the bullshitter, But ocasionally it is nice to sit back and listen to a true professional......So, Carry on.

That's definatly a good trading rifle. I think I would use the T/C and keep the Marlin new.

Hmmm. Do I have anything you need more than a Marlin Carbine?

Wing master

I have always considered myself to be quite the bullshitter, But ocasionally it is nice to sit back and listen to a true professional......So, Carry on.

"Cz 457 in 6.5 grendel? SST"

Remember: Four boxes keep us free ,the soap box, the ballot box, the jury box, AND the cartridge box

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BEAR Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Administrator Joined: 07 September 2013 Location: Appalachian Mtn Status: Offline Points: 14390	Post Options Post Reply Quote BEAR Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: straight walled cartridges for deer hunting Posted: 11 December 2021 at 11:13
	straight walled cartridges for deer hunting Pennsylvania has joined other states in giving'straight walled" firearms special consideation for deer hunting. In past years certain urban areas were restricted to "shotgun only". Now straight walled pistol like cartridge firearms will be allowed in most of those areas. This means pistols and rifles meeting the definition will be allowed. https://www.post-gazette.com/life/ou...nes-Newsletter
	“ The IQ and the life expectancy of the average American recently passed each other in opposite directions.”

d4570 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List .416 Rigby Joined: 27 January 2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 9961	Post Options Post Reply Quote d4570 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 11 December 2021 at 13:02
	HUMM Is a 444 marlin, 450 marlin 45/70 government, and 454 Casull concentered strait wall? I shot my biggest bull elk at just over 500 yards with my 45/70 and +p hand loads. https://shop.centermassinc.com/shop/bfr-revolver-45/70-gvt-75-sts-27465 Edited by d4570 - 11 December 2021 at 13:04
	Remember: Four boxes keep us free ,the soap box, the ballot box, the jury box, AND the cartridge box

BEAR Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Administrator Joined: 07 September 2013 Location: Appalachian Mtn Status: Offline Points: 14390	Post Options Post Reply Quote BEAR Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 11 December 2021 at 13:17
	Yep, seems the new law says some slight taper is allowed. So 45-70 is ok. NO case length or bullet style or size required. I have a 44 mag lever Marrlin (NIB, for 30 years).
	“ The IQ and the life expectancy of the average American recently passed each other in opposite directions.”

d4570 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List .416 Rigby Joined: 27 January 2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 9961	Post Options Post Reply Quote d4570 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 11 December 2021 at 13:58
	The boy has a marlin 44 mag too. Dirty Harry thought a 44 mag pistol was big, put the same round in a rifle as see what you get!!!
	Remember: Four boxes keep us free ,the soap box, the ballot box, the jury box, AND the cartridge box

BEAR Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Administrator Joined: 07 September 2013 Location: Appalachian Mtn Status: Offline Points: 14390	Post Options Post Reply Quote BEAR Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 11 December 2021 at 14:41
	I've killed some deer with the 44 mag in lever rifles. most were at 90 yds of less. Not all exited. I've got a 44 handgun with a scope, never shot anything with it, but paper....very accurate. in reality, deer are very easy to kill with proper shot placement. somehow, if we think they are rugger to kill it makes the challenge and hunt greater?
	“ The IQ and the life expectancy of the average American recently passed each other in opposite directions.”

Irish Bird Dog Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List .416 Rigby Too many Joined: 01 March 2009 Location: Midwest Status: Offline Points: 5574	Post Options Post Reply Quote Irish Bird Dog Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 13 December 2021 at 23:26
	Given a choice I'd rather use a straight wall cartridge in rifle vs shotgun with slug.
	Irish Bird Dog NRA Life/Endowment 2nd Amendment Supporter

Wing master Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Administrator AKA StraightShooter Joined: 10 June 2003 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 8029	Post Options Post Reply Quote Wing master Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 18 December 2021 at 15:44
	If we were restricted to these kinds of things I'd go with a lever action in 45-70. Like D said, It would be effective out to ranges that you wouldn't see in a heavily wooded area. Just my thoughts. Wing master
	I have always considered myself to be quite the bullshitter, But ocasionally it is nice to sit back and listen to a true professional......So, Carry on.

BEAR Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Administrator Joined: 07 September 2013 Location: Appalachian Mtn Status: Offline Points: 14390	Post Options Post Reply Quote BEAR Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 December 2021 at 07:49
	well this lets in pistols, previuosly not allowed. So my 44 mag, 41 mag, 357 mag, and 375 pistols are now legal. 45-70 while works for anything, seems Tooooo much for whitetails...44 mag more appropiate; it more than shoots thru one deer. Seems the 45-70 P+ could harvest 3 or 4 with one shot!!
	“ The IQ and the life expectancy of the average American recently passed each other in opposite directions.”

jsgbearpaws1 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List .416 Rigby Joined: 02 March 2013 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3606	Post Options Post Reply Quote jsgbearpaws1 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 December 2021 at 08:35
	Been looking for a reason to get that 22 short. Straight walled deer slayer up to bear! Without the worry of over penetration! Turnbull makes some fine custom 86's in 45-70, 45-90, 50-70, 50-90 and all the way up to the 50-120. Bigboreleverguns has some loads close to 3k fps with 500gr. hardcast in his 50. Straightwalled and ready to tenderize on either end. More then enough for any of the big five......x2! 12 gauge 1 1/4 oz at 1450 fps vs 220 gr .44 at very similar speed.....gotta favor that 12. Throw in a hot loaded 45-70 and then you get range. Sadly many of the 45-70 loads on the market give you around the same 1400 fps of the other pistol calibers.....which is pretty much what the cartridge was designed at. Killed many a bison with those old low and slow speed boolits way back when. BTW, you can shoot 45 and 50 caliber sabots out of a 12 at speeds rivaling the centerfires. Jerry hits the 1000k gong with his....but then again, he does it with his 44mag as well. Guy is at a whole 'nother level
	...oh yeah! thats gonna hurt!

Irish Bird Dog Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List .416 Rigby Too many Joined: 01 March 2009 Location: Midwest Status: Offline Points: 5574	Post Options Post Reply Quote Irish Bird Dog Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 December 2021 at 10:47
	Some states have case length limits Shorter than the 45-70 case thus eliminating it from a choice.
	Irish Bird Dog NRA Life/Endowment 2nd Amendment Supporter

BEAR Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Administrator Joined: 07 September 2013 Location: Appalachian Mtn Status: Offline Points: 14390	Post Options Post Reply Quote BEAR Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 December 2021 at 11:35
	No limit on case length nor minimum caliber or energy. So 45-70 is in and so is 32ACP in a rifle or revolver (no autoloaders).
	“ The IQ and the life expectancy of the average American recently passed each other in opposite directions.”

Irish Bird Dog Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List .416 Rigby Too many Joined: 01 March 2009 Location: Midwest Status: Offline Points: 5574	Post Options Post Reply Quote Irish Bird Dog Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 December 2021 at 11:41
	Bear.regarding specific rules on straightwall cases..you are speaking for Pennsylvania right??
	Irish Bird Dog NRA Life/Endowment 2nd Amendment Supporter

jsgbearpaws1 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List .416 Rigby Joined: 02 March 2013 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3606	Post Options Post Reply Quote jsgbearpaws1 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 December 2021 at 12:06
	460 S&W is short enough for those rules and will reach out for a deer sized game well past 200 yards. but it does have a tapered case which is allowed for pistol cartridge centerfire. the 500 mag. and 350 Legend seem to be the goto's for the straightwall folks restricted in length. Folks in Ohio can still use the 45-70 but it is the max length cartridge.
	...oh yeah! thats gonna hurt!

BEAR Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Administrator Joined: 07 September 2013 Location: Appalachian Mtn Status: Offline Points: 14390	Post Options Post Reply Quote BEAR Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 December 2021 at 12:30
	Yes in PA. We can have "slight" case taper. Seems the 460 S&W would be OK. Now guys remember we are talking about whitetail deer. Local gun shops in Allegheny County are recommending and stocking 350 ledgend, which I think might even be toooooo much. Right now I have three rifle that quality, 44 mag, 375, 30 carbine (altered to straight-pull action. Edited by BEAR - 19 December 2021 at 12:31
	“ The IQ and the life expectancy of the average American recently passed each other in opposite directions.”

Wing master Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Administrator AKA StraightShooter Joined: 10 June 2003 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 8029	Post Options Post Reply Quote Wing master Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 December 2021 at 19:21
	If you are going to use a rifle that you already have I'd go with your .44 Mag. By the way, What rifle is it? Wing master
	I have always considered myself to be quite the bullshitter, But ocasionally it is nice to sit back and listen to a true professional......So, Carry on.

BEAR Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Administrator Joined: 07 September 2013 Location: Appalachian Mtn Status: Offline Points: 14390	Post Options Post Reply Quote BEAR Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 20 December 2021 at 07:09
	It is a pre-safety marlin crbine (NIB). Bought it for trading stock when it was on Super Sale at Walmart ($62). I could put a red dot on it. Also have a T/C contender in 44 mag that shoots lights out, has a 2-4x scope and target grips, I think DD's son was shooting it to hit plastic bottles at 45 yards in Wyoming. That kid can really shoot...must have his dad's eyesight!
	“ The IQ and the life expectancy of the average American recently passed each other in opposite directions.”

Wing master Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Administrator AKA StraightShooter Joined: 10 June 2003 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 8029	Post Options Post Reply Quote Wing master Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 21 December 2021 at 20:30
	That's definatly a good trading rifle. I think I would use the T/C and keep the Marlin new. Hmmm. Do I have anything you need more than a Marlin Carbine? Wing master
	I have always considered myself to be quite the bullshitter, But ocasionally it is nice to sit back and listen to a true professional......So, Carry on.

BEAR Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Administrator Joined: 07 September 2013 Location: Appalachian Mtn Status: Offline Points: 14390	Post Options Post Reply Quote BEAR Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 22 December 2021 at 07:50
	Cz 457 in 6.5 grendel? SST There were some small cartridges that I sort of thought about, but my 222 rem has filled all those voids. I am drawn to guns with 'cool' actions and anything with a full manlicher stock, maybe a 7x57 ruger!
	“ The IQ and the life expectancy of the average American recently passed each other in opposite directions.”

d4570 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List .416 Rigby Joined: 27 January 2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 9961	Post Options Post Reply Quote d4570 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 22 December 2021 at 08:24
	"Cz 457 in 6.5 grendel? SST"
	Remember: Four boxes keep us free ,the soap box, the ballot box, the jury box, AND the cartridge box

BEAR Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Administrator Joined: 07 September 2013 Location: Appalachian Mtn Status: Offline Points: 14390	Post Options Post Reply Quote BEAR Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 22 December 2021 at 10:19
	Yea D. for similiar reason as your decision. Some day....maybe....my only grandson may come back to the USA. I'll most likely not be young enough to hunt then and he will be just about perfect age to hunt. thinking a 6.5 grendel is just about perfect to learn to shoot and still serve as 'th e deer rifle' to a youngster for a few years.
	“ The IQ and the life expectancy of the average American recently passed each other in opposite directions.”